“It was evident at the Synaxis of October, 2008, which forthrightly called for a Great and Holy Council- the last was held in 1872.”

I thought the last Great and Holy Council was in 787.

All are punished … because there is no brotherly love. Scary … Lord have mercy!

The way do deal with such complicated issues is shown by the Elder Paisios of the Holy Mount Athos:

Guard the secret as well as you can and don’t indulge in excessive frankness.

If we expose someone out of love, with pain in our hearts, then a change will occur in his heart whether he understands us or not. But to expose without love, with partiality, only enrages to object of our exposure. Our hostility strikes against his egoism, producing sparks like flint against steel.

Sweet words and great truths have value when uttered by righteous lips. They take root only in people of good will and clean conscience.

Truth, when used without judgment, can commit a crime. And he who possesses sincerity without reason commits a twofold evil, first against himself, then against others. Because there’s no empathy in his sincerity. A Christian must not be a fanatic but have love in his heart for all. He who throws words around carelessly, even true words, does evil.

Eliot, the exchange reminds me of the beginning of Romeo and Juliet in which servants of Montague and Capulet have the following exchange:
“Do you bite your thumb (akin to giving the finger) at me sir”
“At you sir, no sir, but I do bite my tumb sir”

We all know how that story ends: “Montague, Capulet, see what a scourge is laid upon thy hate that heaven doth find means to kill thy joys with love, and I for winking at your discords have lost a brace of kinsmen. All are punished.”

Seraphim I truly applaud your reasoning and graciousness. Having said that, if we are to conceed your point, that because Lambrianides’ weltanschaung represents the Phanar and as such deserves to be heard –if only for that reason–then it also stands to reason that Lambrianides be brought to task for his historical illiteracy (to say nothing of his horrible misunderstanding of American culture). This can be done by any number of ways: having a panel dissect his sloppy reaserch, a vigorous questioning by the students and attendees, or better yet, a reasoned response by an honest critic. To rsspond to a critic face-to-face and to allow a vigorous (and civil) debate is the essence of higher education.

There is an ‘interesting’ comment on Catholic Online. Looks like the discussions will never go beyond “who has the Truth?”

amen. That is in fact the only criterion of genuince apostolicity/

Good point George. Let’s see who can grow the church in the apostolic faith. You will know them by their fruit.

My piece on Catholic Online is up:

http://www.catholic.org/national/national_story.php?id=36481

I jumpted the gun a bit. My apologies.

Scott, you’re absolutely right. Unless and until there are serious movements towards dividing up existing dioceses into real, discreet political entities, then it’ll be more of the same. That’s not a bad thing however, since the various jurisdictions will continue their independent existence. If an ethnic jurisdiction complains about new missions opening up nearby by the more evangelical-minded churches, well…too bad. It may goad them to some serious action.

Harry, I think that the real force behind these EAs is Moscow. Look how they wormed their way up past Alexandria and Jerusalem in the protocols worked out in Chambesy (but not yet in the actual Diptychs –that’s next). It’s really rather brilliant. What can we expect from a nation in which chess is a spectator sport?

George & Eliot, I agree with both of you.

George, if Father Elpidophoros’ talk at Holy Cross last year is anything close to representative of his intellectual capabilities then he truly is the antithesis of a scholar. Last I knew, fabricating history & no-holds-bared circular reasoning were considered illegitimate tactics in a serious discussion.

Eliot, I sympathize with you in finding it unfortunate at Saint Vladimir’s awarded Archbishop Rowan Williams an honorary doctorate degree. It is one thing to invite the man speak & an entirely different matter to bestow a prestigious academic award on him. Be that as it may, I still laud Saint Vladimir’s for its commitment to promoting open dialogue & debate.

My point is simply that it takes a great measure of patience & humility to allow others to share their ideas, especially if those ideas are regarded as offensive & absurd by many of your peers. Of course Archimandrite Elpidophoros has already proven that he is far from the ilk of Jarolsav Pelikan & Father Alexander Schmemann. This goes without saying. Despite this, no matter how obnoxious or ridiculous his assertions may have been (or will be) they do represent the unofficial position of the Patriarchate of Constantinople, and therefore, merit some discussion & debate because whether we like it or not they DO matter when it comes to the world-wide Orthodox Church & Orthodox unity. The bishops & others at the Phanar need to know that Americans are gracious hosts, but this does not mean that we are ignorant, docile peasants of some by-gone imperial era. We are an educated, articulate, critical and demanding populous. We expect people to be accountable for their words & this is what I am anticipating will happen at Saint Vladimir’s in June.

SCOBA was a creature of the locals in America, the EAs (while possibly not generating anything different than SCOBA) is a creature managed from overseas and mostly from Istanbul/EP.

Anyhow, in our parish we hold a huge festival to pay off ‘distant centers’ in exchange for no new faces — and if the lady who manages our choir and plays the organ didn’t donate her fee back to the church we’d have a problem. But, we do it every year, so it must be ok. A Vegitarian? You don’t eat no meat? It’s okay, I’ll make lamb.

“If SCOBA II was the goal in other words, why not remain with the status-quo?”

To create the impression of forward movement without actually doing so? This temporarily – – i.e., so long as people buy the rhetoric – – relieves some of whatever pressure is directed at the leadership to move toward unity. Now they can have press releases and cultivate enthusiasm about the Big New Thing for awhile.

Fr, Johannes, none of it makes the slightest bit of difference until they start dividing up territory among the bishops. That, and only that, would indicate seriousness.

P.S.: I wasn’t making a moral comparison of slavery and abortion. What I was saying is that abortion has been condemned by the Church from the very beginning. This is not true with slavery. It makes perfect sense to cut those in slave holding states some slack in light of the fact that moral opposition to slavery was an emerging opinion in the 18th and 19th centuries.

Opposition to abortion among Christians was fairly uniform before the twentieth century. In fact, the first church to actually even approve of contraception was the Episcopal Church back in 1930. It’s not a question of giving politicians and operatives time to adjust to the emerging moral wave. The emerging moral wave of the 60’s and 70’s was toward approving of abortion on demand. Mr. Marudas’ and Sen. Sarbanes seem to have adjusted to that moral developement (or decay) all too well. Outrage might be a better response to their position since they have had almost 2000 years of notice as to what Christianity teaches. They may not be ideologically commited to the destruction of the unborn but they are ideologically commited to a woman’s “right” to destroy her unborn. That amounts to the same thing.

However, after pausing for a moment, I realized that this is precisely why I respect Saint Vladimir’s Seminary so much. As an academic institution they have the integrity & objectivity to hear “other” perspectives & engage in dialogue on controversial matters.

So, shall we start again? … remember Dr. Rowan’s stand against the moral tradition while “lecturing” on the Philokalia. I really do not understand how the conferring of the honorary degree does not imply an endorsement. It has been said plenty on the subject, but it seems that nobody cares.