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Comments on: Quiet Flows the Mississippi into the Matrix of Mystery https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/ A Research and Educational Organization that engages the cultural issues of the day within the Orthodox Christian Tradition Wed, 15 Jul 2009 05:19:32 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.3.3 By: Greek in Memphis https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-5013 Wed, 15 Jul 2009 05:19:32 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-5013 I can hardly wait for his visit now after reading the dossier for the symposium. Ugh … very disappointing.

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By: Chrys https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4878 Sat, 04 Jul 2009 01:06:40 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4878 Forgive me for repeating a rant I have made elsewhere, but my concern is not just the content of the a highly debatable political position, but what it may indicate about their actual focus and priorities. It is my understanding that, at a minimum, a Christian knows that the glory of God and the salvation and transformation of the human person are of ultimate and eternal importance. It is out of this basic context that the Christian (especially a Christian leader) views the other issues of life.

From this perspective, it would seem evident that the REAL cause of global destruction is not a particular economic system or cultural phenomenon, nor is the REAL solution a series of “green” behaviors. (At the risk of repetition, even the most radically “green” person might cleanse the world and still lose his soul.) Rather, the REAL cause of environmental distress is . . . sin. (In fact, it is hard to imagine any theological insight into life that does not recognize that the “root cause” of almost every social crisis – whatever its form “du jour” – is ultimately sin.) This is not to diminish to value of particular policies or political solutions, but it is to recognize their limits. Scripture, however, makes the diagnosis particularly clear in this case:

“For the creation was subjected to futility—not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it—in the hope that the creation itself will also be set free from the bondage of corruption into the glorious freedom of God’s children. For we know that the whole creation has been groaning together with labor pains until now. And not only that, but we ourselves who have the Spirit as the first fruits —we also groan within ourselves, eagerly waiting for adoption, the redemption of our bodies.” (Romans 8:20-23)

This, it seems to me, should be immediately apparent to a Christian, let alone a Christian leader. Moreover, if one understands that the real cause of the “corruption” of the earth lies in sin and the real solution depends on conversion and theosis, then one must also recognize the surpassing importance of the pastoral call in fostering conversion and theosis.

When our leadership makes the political crisis “du jour” the basis of a rare visit, it calls into question the character of their priorities and the value they give to their pastoral mission.

Christ calls all of us – but especially His leadership (who, like all genuine leaders, must lead by example) – to give up everything else for the “pearl” of the kingdom of God, and yet promises that when we do this we will gain everything else besides. Wouldn’t this apply – for the Christian – to “green” agenda as well?

Thus, if our leadership were to give wholehearted focus solely to the spiritual formation of those in their charge, fostering in them the acquisition of the spirit, then, as St. Seraphim said, thousands will be saved. If St. Maximos and St. Paul are correct, then the cosmos, too, will be transfigured. Presumably this includes the earth.

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By: George Michalopulos https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4875 Fri, 03 Jul 2009 23:06:51 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4875 John, I just re-read your editorial. The last line excited a neuron, towit: it’s just possible that the Phanar/GOA-HQ is no longer beholden to the Greek-American elite bigwigs that that normally populate the finer venues of NYC like the Waldorf. They know how Tucker’s and her ilk’s talk about redistribution would go over so there may be two tacks here: the normal, big, fat Greek shindig to see and be seen with the hierarchy and keep peasants in the pews sedated and a separate tack with the NGO/Left/pantheist crowd where the action really is. I’m just saying… Anybody think I’m on to something? I could be all wet.

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By: George Michalopulos https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4874 Fri, 03 Jul 2009 22:52:29 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4874 Fr, you are definately onto something. I remember about 12 years ago, I was on a family vacation in England. While outside Bath Abbey, I noticed a makeshift kiosk asking people to sign a petition outlawing hunting. (This was right Before Blair and New Labour won.)

Anyway, I thought: “OK, I’ll bite.” Anyway, I ambled over there and asked them why they were against hunting. I couldn’t get a straight answer except something along the line of “it’s inhumane.” So I tried a different tack. I asked, “do animals hunt?” That threw them for a loop. So then I went in for the kill: “Well, aren’t humans animals?” This totally discombobulated the person. I went on: “Since we’re all products of evolution and there is no God, then why can’t human beings hunt? Aren’t we part of nature?”

The poor guy (I think he was a guy) said, was “well, maybe we’re the wrong part of nature.” I kid you not. He said it with a sneer. For the first time I think I looked into the face of a true misanthrope, a human who hated humans. It was a diabolical look on his face. I shooked my head and walked away.

I should have said, well, “if we’re so bad, why don’t you just go on a shooting spree, kill as many people as possible and then turn the gun on yourself?”

What’s my point? Why in God’s holy name would we want to ally ourselves with this demonic fringe?

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By: Fr. Johannes Jacobse https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4873 Fri, 03 Jul 2009 22:27:44 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4873 Cynthia, the environmentalist left has little regard for human creativity. They are instead neo-Malthusian, seeing mankind as a blight on the earth, and only by controlling the decisions and actions of people can the pristine Eden be restored. It is a materialistic ideology, laden with religious language to be sure, but really seeks the control and reorganization of economic and social structures — with the environmentalists making the decisions of course.

Thus, your insight is a good one. You are asking why don’t they take into account human creativity? Doesn’t the re-fashioning of the material creation count — especially when things of beauty and utility are created? Their answer, ultimately, is no.

Further, the Ecumenical Patriarchate is making an alliance with a political ideology that, when pressed, is quite hostile to the moral precepts of traditional Christianity unless it can throw the entire package into that bucket that levels all religions as essentially equal — and thus equally irrelevant.

Is this why Constantinople is silent on almost every other moral issue facing Western civilization?

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By: Cynthia Curran https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4869 Fri, 03 Jul 2009 21:29:24 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4869 I think the problem with many christians is that they only see the natural creation as the only product of God. Why not the various Byzantine Churches or Gothic Catholic Churches, or Bridges, or sewer systems or other things we built. After all, God gives us the ability to create these things since he is responsible for us having a brain in the first place. So, why don’t we view man-made objects are just apart of God as nature is.

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By: George Michalopulos https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4867 Fri, 03 Jul 2009 20:48:29 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4867 Chris, John, et al: Besides discerning the fact that the words, “Jesus,” “Christ,” and “Gospel” are nowhere to be found in the prospectus for the symposium, I would like to pose a question to all the OCA-haters on this website. I’m not talking about those already within the GOA, but those who belong to more (how shall I say it?), “rigorous” and “traditionalist” subsets of Orthodoxy in America: how eager are you now to subjugate yourselves to an eparchy that is and always will be, beholden to the worldly, politically left-wing attuned Phanar? Especially one which is now a wholly-owned subsidiary of the WCC?

Because of our fallen nature, one of the unpleasant facts of life is that you often have to “pick your poison.” Unlike our beloved president, we don’t have the option of voting “present.”

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By: Chris Banescu https://www.aoiusa.org/quiet-flows-the-mississippi-into-the-matrix-of-mystery/#comment-4864 Fri, 03 Jul 2009 18:35:44 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=2757#comment-4864 I urge everyone to go to this page:
SYMPOSIUM VIII
Restoring Balance: The Great Mississippi River under the patronage of His All Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew
18th – 25th October 2009
http://www.rsesymposia.org/more.php?pcatid=184&catid=185

And try to find the words “Jesus”, “Christ”, or “Gospel” in any of the activities planned. Notice also the one-sided manner in which these symposiums reflect the biased and subjective views of AlGore and virtually all radical-environmentalist groups. These groups, BTW, only criticize America and western democracies for their “sins” against mother nature, but say nothing of the massive pollution and destruction of nature that goes on in all communist countries and other totalitarian regimes; not to mention the killing and torture of human beings who are part of that very same nature these neo-pagan worshipers glorify.

Interestingly enough, polar bears, whales, monkeys, and trees are to be protected at all costs, but the lives and liberties of innocent men, women, and children don’t deserve the same protections it seems.

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