Comments on: Papal Theologian: Treating Homosexuals with Dignity Means Telling Them the Truth

By: Rostislav

Rostislav — Wed, 14 Aug 2013 07:18:03 +0000

In reply to Jaego. I hardly think that the Holy Fathers illumined by the HOLY SPIRIT didn’t “understand the words” of the Council of Chalcedon. They understood them all too well in their soteriological context. Not to belabor cyrillian vs. Chalcedonian Christology and the Christological controversy sparked by the Robber Synod of Ephesus: ultimately, the way we understand CHRIST enables us to understand how we are saved and the life of theosis, where “words” and formulae express eschatological realities in regard to our salvation. Our Christological understandings are the underpinnings of the Life which saves. Indeed, it is only the most intelligent which can formulate these “words” for they are spoken relating the Mind of CHRIST, the phronema, by the HOLY SPIRIT, and no man made conventions could ever in any way be superior.

By: Jaego

Jaego — Wed, 14 Aug 2013 01:37:16 +0000

Such simple disagreements lead to wars. The Copts actually cheered when the Muslims drove the Orthodox out of Egypt, such was their suffering under them. Fifteen hundred years later people realized the whole dispute was much ado about little, just a different way of explaining the same thing. The Copts emphasized the oneness of God and thus sounded like heretics to the Orthodox conquerors. We must rise above words to understanding. We do that by studying words and using them well. At some point we’ll get so good at it that we realize that intelligence is prior and superior to words. Then we can use them consciously as a craftsman does his tools.

By: Rostislav

Rostislav — Wed, 10 Jul 2013 20:40:58 +0000

In reply to timothy johnson.

The Church is the BODY of CHRIST fulfilling humanity and those who live in it live by HIS BODY AND BLOOD. Thus, the Church is CHRIST. I don’t understand.

The FATHER created by the WORD in the SPIRIT. There was never a time before CHRIST. All of creation was created with the freedom to glorify GOD and actualize its fullest life in grace. It was created as a Church. That is why Orthodox theologians write of the “Old Testament Church”.

CHRIST came to restore the falleness of humanity to uplift it and restore creation. HE came to “found” a restored humanity and creation in HIS CHURCH, HIS BODY, restored to its vocation as becoming the Temple of GOD. The Church then is an epitome of the GOD man.

As we participate in the uncreated energies, we become temples of the SPIRIT and the deifying grace which saves us spills over on to creation and sanctifies it to the greater glory of GOD. This is done by the FATHER through the SON in the HOLY SPIRIT as a result of the Incarnation, Life, Crucifixion, Resurrection, Ascension of CHRIST JESUS, the GOD-man, seated at the Right Hand of GOD the FATHER. The Holy Mysteries, especially the Eucharist, convey this theanthropic PRESENCE and LIFE. But even “sacramentals” such as the WORD in SCRIPTURE relate HIS Presence in grace.

HE has exalted our humanity by kenotically assuming it and perfecting it in toto by nature, will, energy and ascending to it in its perfection to GOD the Father, glorifying it and thereby providing for us the means of our deification and full reconciliation with GOD. For HE defeated sin and death and united humanity to divinity, holiness and immortality. The curse and power of sin and death is abolished in CHRIST JESUS.

The fulfillment of creation in the eschaton is the Second Coming of CHRIST, where it is bathed and glorified in HIS Love and consecrated in HIS holiness to its vocation as a New Jerusalem, the abode and Temple of the Almighty GOD.

By: Fr. Johannes Jacobse

Fr. Johannes Jacobse — Wed, 10 Jul 2013 13:17:10 +0000

In reply to Fr. Johannes Jacobse. Look, the man is speaking historically, not theologically. Sure, there is no time "before Christ" broadly speaking. However, there was a time in human history before which the self-revelation of the Pre-incarnate Logos who was revealed to the world as Jesus Christ occurred. That is what is meant by "before Christ." Look at it this way: The Gospel of John could only (and was) written after the first coming of Christ (...revealed and dwelt among us...). That period before Christ came we call, well, the period "before Christ."

By: timothy johnson

timothy johnson — Wed, 10 Jul 2013 02:37:49 +0000

In reply to Fr. Johannes Jacobse.

Perhaps you could describe this fabled “time before Christ?”
So you don’t believe the the first chapter of the Gospel of John? which of course merely says what all creation has been saying for, well, some time now.
And once you’ve so de-scribed such a time, then explain what, exactly, or perhaps better, Who, kept things going there during that …. time….as you call it, “before Christ.”
then, maybe you can go on to describe that period “after Christ,”…….
gads….

do you think about what you write, what you think?

It does make ME think that this is part of a problem, when people confuse the church with the Lord; …..

By: Fr. Johannes Jacobse

Fr. Johannes Jacobse — Mon, 08 Jul 2013 13:59:13 +0000

In reply to timothy johnson. Why should a "Christian theologian" refrain from speaking about a time before Christ? History is history.

By: timothy johnson

timothy johnson — Mon, 08 Jul 2013 04:42:13 +0000

“The Church, standing up to this ideology which we are seeing now in the Western world, the Church is saying something very normal and humane, which corresponds to the understanding of humanity, which humanity has had for millennia, long before Christ, long before the appearance of Christianity.”

On a not minor point: any Christian theologian should probably refrain from speaking about a time “before Christ.”…… .what in hell, so to speak, does THAT mean….
I seem to remember something said, or written, about “before the foundations of the world…” something said to Eve about a heel………