Comments on: Orthodox Worried Over ‘No Crucifixes’ Ruling

By: George Michalopulos

George Michalopulos — Sat, 28 Nov 2009 15:34:34 +0000

Theodoros, I was in Greece in the summer of 2000 when +Christodoulos called out the people. I can guarantee you that in Athens alone, there were at least 250,000 there. I was caught in the middle of it, just walking down the street going from, not entirely aware of what was going on. Lemme tell you, it was a first class afair, what with jumbotrons, flags, etc.

By: cynthia curran

cynthia curran — Thu, 26 Nov 2009 01:19:13 +0000

I mean,the United States is about 30 percent Roman Catholic

By: cynthia curran

cynthia curran — Thu, 26 Nov 2009 01:18:06 +0000

Well, the government is too much in Greece. Now, in the United States people would not want posters of Billy Grahram or so forth in public schools since the United States is about 30 percent and 2 percent non-christian religons but Greece is very different. Greece is 98 percent Orthodox and most people prefer icons in public schools. As for Mt Athos this is stupid as well. There are also women religious communties that don’t allowed men, so men should be allowed to have religious communties that allow only women. The EU is too involved with the politics of the countries it represent. Being more conservative in nature, I prefer that the countries of Europe should have a right to determined their own views on these subjects mention above

By: Theodoros

Theodoros — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 23:26:38 +0000

That the Socialist government is pushing this is not a surprise. They have
been trying to attack the Church for many years including in their previous
tenure in power between 1996 and 2004.

In 2004, then Archbishop Christodoulos called out anywhere between 100,000
and 800,000 people (depending which statistics are to be believed) in
Athens and Thessaloniki to protest the removal of religion from identity
cards and public life.

The Church was able to get 3 million people in Greece to sign a petition
protesting the removal of religion from public life in the period after.

The Church of Greece already scored a minor victory over the previous
government in 2008 when it pressured the government to restore history
to school books which were altered in the interest of political correctness
and the appeasement of Turkey.

The Greek Education ministry began removing references to the massacre of
Greek Orthodox Christians in Smyrna in 1922 and the horrors of the
Ottoman era Janissary system which kidnapped and converted Christian boys
to Islam under the Turkish era. The Church was able with conservative
elements in Greece able to overturn this foolishness.

The problems the Church of Greece presently faces,

1)Removal of Icons from public buildings and schools

2)The desire of far left wing elements to legalize same sex marriage.
The Church has made very clear in many of its own newspapers that it will
fight any such moves.

3)European feminists in the EU have stated that they consider Mount Athos
to be practicing discrimination against women since females may not enter
the Holy Mountain. The arguments by European leftists are that since Mount
Athos is European territory, there must be access for all.

The European influence on Greece has been detrimental on the whole, but
there is still a great deal of traditionalist and conservative thought in
Greece.

The Church has a good chance of forcing the Socialists to back off on the
removal of Icons. Everything will depend if they can mobilize the faithful
of Greece. The Church of Greece I think has been waiting to defend itself
from the onslought of the secularists for the last few years.

The late Archbishop Christodoulos (1998-2008) was loved by most of the
people in Greece. His funeral service attracted at least a few hundred
thousand mourners in Athens.

The Church of Greece still has influence in society, that in turn is why
it is despised by the Socialist left which embraces every aspect of
foolishness that the European Union advocates.

Theodoros

By: Andrew

Andrew — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 20:40:58 +0000

E-Katherimini is reporting that icons may have to go in Greece. The Church is involved and against it but the fact that the government is pushing this does raise eyebrows. Greeks got the change they voted for and the cultural suicide continues.

http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_articles_politics_100010_25/11/2009_112763

Religious icons may have to go

Justice Minister Haris Kastanidis admitted yesterday that Greece will have no choice but to remove religious icons from school classrooms and other public buildings if the European Court of Human Rights stands by a ruling it made earlier this month.

“If the European Court of Human Rights sticks to its original decision that religious symbols should be removed from all public buildings, then I think our country will have to adapt to the new situation arising from this decision,” said Kastanidis in response to a question from right-wing Popular Orthodox Rally (LAOS) MP Asterios Rondoulis.

However, Kastanidis added that any change to the status quo, which sees icons of the Virgin Mary hung in classrooms, courtrooms and public service offices, would take place “only after agreement has been reached with the Church of Greece.”

However, it seems that the Church is highly unlikely to concede to the removal of icons or crucifixes from buildings.

The Church of Greece reacted angrily to such suggestions when it emerged earlier this month that the European Court of Human Rights had ruled that the presence of crucifixes in classrooms was a breach of human rights after hearing a case brought by a mother from Italy.

“It is not only minorities that have rights, the majority has them as well,” said the head of the Greek Church, Archbishop Ieronymos, adding that the matter would be discussed by the Holy Synod if necessary.

“Youngsters will soon not have any symbols to inspire and protect them,” said Bishop Nikolaos of Fthiotida. Bishop Anthimos of Thessaloniki said he hopes Greek officials will appeal any decision by the court in Strasbourg.

The European court found that the right of parents to educate their children according to their own beliefs, and children’s right to freedom of religion, were breached by the presence of a crucifix in classrooms.

By: Nick Katich

Nick Katich — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 12:09:24 +0000

This should be a wake up call that we have reverted back to the time of the first three centuries. Blessed are we when men shall revile us, persecute us and speak all manner of evil against us for His namesake. It is time that petty squabbles between us and amongst our bishops stops. It is time for our hierarchs to become leaders of men and not lords of fiefdoms. It is time that we start to recognize that we are once again catacombe church within our own countries. It is time again for martyrdom, if necessary, rather than complacency. It is a time for us to openly shame our Orthodox politicians who put their left wing politics above the Church’s moral teachings by quit giving them money just because of their ethnicity and quit communing them because of their actions. It is a time to form political alliances with all those who profess Christ even if not in our way for we will have nothing to squabble about with them if our collective enemies get their way. It is also the time to reject any of our leaders too timid or too unwilling to lead. No one has the right to be called and honored as a bishop, a clergyman or even a member of the royal priesthood who does not speak out against these continued outrages. God save us all from our complacency, timidity and stupidity developed over seventeen centuries. We are being given a second chance to get it right. I fear it will also be our last chance.

By: George Michalopulos

George Michalopulos — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 10:40:02 +0000

Bravo to the Church of Greece! As to the issue at hand, besides the obvious abomination that it is, this should give all Americans pause about treaties such as the upcoming Copenhagen treaty. Like the one that governs the EU, nations lose their sovereignty when they do the “feel-good” thing and sign the damn things. I wonder if the brainiacs over at 79th St/Phanar have figured that out? Aren’t there any Greek-American lawyers in the Archons or any of the various diocesan boards?