True, but as the saying goes, “…and when he’s bad, he’s a terror!” : )
]]>Also Rev Fr Dr Archimandrite Hopebearer was forced to concelebrate as well. Who says the Lord doesn’t have a sense of humor?
]]>The EP himself concelebrated with the representative of the OCA in Moscow, Archm. Zacchaeus, and had to hear Met. Jonah as primate of the OCA commemorated in the diptychs this week.
]]>If the Ecumenical Patriarchate speaks of the OCA as “uncanonical” it does not mean that it thinks OCA sacraments are “invalid” or any such thing.
“Uncanonical” is a mere reference to not recognizing OCA Autocephaly, which means the EP would look at us more like a Metropolia under Moscow (which the OCA once was).
In nearly every major city you can find GOA clergy and OCA clergy (and even bishops) concelebrating the holy mysteries, and the EP knows this and obviously doesn’t speak against it.
Throwing around words like “valid” and “invalid” when in an inter-Orthodox discussion is really not necessary and can be dangerously confusing.
Actually, even if there is open schism in the Church, or if a small schismatic group breaks away, the Church is reluctant to immediately speak in terms of “valid” and “invalid” sacraments (historically, there has always been a distinction between schism and heresy -the latter being when issues of “validity” come up).
In inter-Orthodox discussions we should all refrain from terms like “valid” and “invalid”.
LOL. Given the state of Greece, that won’t work this time.
]]>Like a wheel off its axle.
]]>Exactly.
Btw, were ROCOR and the Patriarchal administrator seated together?
The fact that the OCA was not seated with either says something. Don’t worry, the Phanar can hear it, especially as the EP just had to hear the OCA in the diptychs, concelebrating with the PoM and the representative of the OCA on St. Cyril and Methodios’ day. And then the Russians retired to Optino without inviting the guest EP.
]]>]]>Makes what unlikely, Isa?
The OCA did NOT get a seat on the executive committee.
I was hoping that +Dimetrious would do the right thing – I was wrong.
According to Black Bart, we (the OCA) are a non-canonical church. That means our sacraments are not valid. I’d stay with Antioch if I were you.
LOL. The fallible pronouncements of the Ultramarist Phanar doesn’t make we worry a bit. I just went to communion in an OCA Church two weeks ago.
Focus less on the surface, and see how Arb. Demetrios, Met. Philip and Met. Jonah’s actions are complementing each other, much to the Phanar’s dismay.
I’m waiting for the official pronouncements on the Executive Committee.
I remember Fr. Arey’s press efforts well from the Spyridon days. He’s a good soldier in that he does what he’s told with such panache as he can muster with — ah, what he has been given to work with.
]]>If the OCA wasn’t considered autocephalous, but they consider the OCA bishops as such, then they would have been seated with the Russian Bishops. That they were seated together is a recognition of the OCA’s status.
If as you say the OCA was denied a seat on an executive committee, well, perhaps the others on the committee will as their first matter of business vote to correct that oversight.
]]>]]>Those who are familiar with the Gospel should not be astonished at what happened next, for did the Lord not say that faith as small as a mustard seed is enough to move mountains? Strong in his faith, the blessed one returned with the plate of pilaff to the stable and, as he was petitioning the Lord, in answer to his firm entreaty, the plate disappeared. What was the amazement of the entire household when the Agha finally returned from Mecca bringing with him the copper plate which had held the food. He had been equally astonished to discover the steaming plate of pilaff upon his return from the Mosque to the locked room where he was staying. Still greater was his confusion when he realized that the copper plate was engraved with his initials–just as all the vessels in his house. “For the sake of Allah, I cannot understand how it came even unto Mecca and who brought it!” When his wife told him of John’s request, they recognized the strange occurrence to be a miracle of God, and henceforth all considered John as a righteous man who had found favor with God.
Is there a list of those bishops who actually showed up?
Despite the fairly high resolution of the four pictures posted on the GOA site, with their kamilafke, some bishops are hard to distinguish.
Second, I’d note that a few commentators here have made passing reference to the “Serbian” bishops, and even expressed some hope in them.
I respectfully suggest, that those wishing for a unified church, forget about “the Serbs.” Any speculation that they would support severing the umbilical cord to Belgrade should be quashed — with a pile driver.
Metropolitan Christopher is largely considered a grossly ineffectual nuisance — in Belgrade and in the USA. And, he speaks out of the both sides of his mouth. For every word he utters that would hint to one person that he is for a no strings attached autocephalous American church, there are just as many comments in other contexts that point in the completely opposite direction. Within the last year, he has a newly created diocese, “the Metropolitanate of Chicago-Libertyville.” It consists of the Monastery of St. Sava in Libertyville, Illinois, and a single parish in Chicago. Though he is among the most senior bishops in the SOC by ordination, he is a complete non-factor.
Bishop Longin of Midwestern America contemplated not attending the EA, thinking that little would take place. As an “administrator,” he’s completely clueless.
As to scandal plagued, morally impaired, imperious Bishop George of Canada, he demands complete subservience to Belgrade. Canada is just another diocese in the SOC, albeit a little farther away from his favorite village. Frankly, I would be surprised if he is at the EA. He hardly even attends meetings of the Episcopal Council of the SOC in the USA.
As to “Don” Mitrophan of Eastern America — the SOC bishop who did not attend the South American EA — he is generally disengaged.
Bishop Maxim of Western America, he “gets it,” but is much more concerned about raging liturgical controversies in the SOC about the epiklisis and other practices. His theological — but not necessarily ecclesiological — inclinations are with the Phanar rather than Moscow.
In short, the SOC bishops will do whatever is politically expedient for that nanosecond. Their attention has been on Kosovo for the past couple of years. The power struggles in the Synod and Holy Assembly created during the protracted illness and recent death of the Saintly Patriarch Paul rage on.
Earlier this year, Bartholemew served at Paul’s funeral; Kyrill did not attend. Key members of the SOC Synod have spent considerable time at the Phanar over the last two years or so; far more time than in Moscow — even though Belgrade maintains an episcopal, “representational” presence in Moscow.
These days, the SOC — whether expressed by individual bishops or in some quasi coordinated cacophany — will sell out to anyone who offers them something they believe will “help” Kosovo, that geopolitically long lost cause. Today, they will flirt with Rome so long as some Vatican bureaucrat says something nice to the EU Minister for Underwater Basketweaving. Tomorrow, they will exhort their Slavic heroes in Moscow, so long as the Duma condemns the West’s diplomacy on some subject. And, the day after, well, Istanbul has a reasonable read of the 28th Canon of Chalcedon afterall … because, of course, momentarily, they have a common dislike of the Macedonian Orthodox Church. Certainly, you see, the newly created “Autonomous Archbishopic of Ohrid” is the only game in town. Nevermind the fact that in 1958 the SOC “created” what is now considered the “schismatic” MOC.
Forget the Serbs.
God help us all.
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