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Comments on: Medved: Does It Matter if only 1.4% of People are Gay? https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/ A Research and Educational Organization that engages the cultural issues of the day within the Orthodox Christian Tradition Sat, 14 Apr 2018 01:54:55 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.3.3 By: cynthia curran https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20539 Sun, 12 Jun 2011 02:05:41 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20539 True, in the old Byzantine empire some emperors use the Justinian code to punished homosexauls in the upper classes. Actually, castration didn’t work either some castrated males of the time period placed the passive role in a homosexual relationship. I think that evangelicals that try to pushed threapy are trying at a modern verison of this. Its true that some homosexauls try the celbate path, actually it seems that Lesbians can make the change easier than homosexaul men.

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By: Isa Almisry https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20510 Thu, 09 Jun 2011 15:38:26 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20510

The nation’s increasingly visible and influential gay community embraces the notion of sexual orientation as an innate, immutable characteristic, like left-handedness or eye color

Many of my left handed elders were forced to change into right handers, and us lefties still have to learn to live in a right handed world, and there are contact lens, so their notion of comparison is rather strange.

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By: Fr. Johannes Jacobse https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20499 Mon, 06 Jun 2011 17:21:54 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20499 In reply to Jerry L.

Very true Jerry. When you don’t have a family to support, there’s a lot of extra discretionary cash lying around.

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By: Jerry L https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20497 Mon, 06 Jun 2011 15:27:34 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20497 In reply to George Patsourakos.

There’s also a certain amount of disposable income in the homosexual community that allows this community to be vocal.

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By: Fabio L Leite https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20429 Thu, 02 Jun 2011 16:51:01 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20429 In reply to Fabio L Leite.

which reminds of this poem:

Poem in Straight Line
by Alvaro de Campos

I never met someone who has been beaten.
All my acquaintances have been champions in everything.

And I, so many times a scum, so many times a pig, so many times vile,
I, so many times unjustifiably a parasite,
Inexcusably filthy,
I, who so many times have not had the patience to take a bath,
I, who so many times have been ridiculous, absurd,
Who have tangled my feet publically in the carpets of etiquette,
Who have been grotesque, petty, submissive and arrogant,
Who have suffered humiliations silently,
Who, when I have not been silent, have been even more ridicule,
I, who have been comical to hotel maids,
I, who have felt the blinking of bellboys,
I, who have suffered financial shame, borrowed without paying,
I, who when the punch came, ducked
Away from the possibility of the punch;
I, who have suffered the anguish of the small ridiculous things,
I realize that in this I have no peer in the world.

None who I know and who talk to me
None of them had a ridiculous act, never a humiliation,
They have never been but princes – all of them princes – in life…

I wish I could hear from someone a human voice
Who confessed not a sin, but an infamy;
Who told not about a violence, but a cowardice!
No, they are nothing less than Ideal, if I hear them and if they speak to me.
Who in this wide world can confess to me they have been vile?

O princes, my brethren,
Geez, I am fed up of demigods!
Where are there people in this world?

Perchance am I alone in being vile and in error on this Earth?

They may have been not loved by women,
They could have been betrayed – but ridiculous? Never!
I, who have been ridiculous without having been betrayed,
How can I speak to my superiors without hesitating?
I, who have been vile, literally vile,
Vile in the petty and despicable sense of vileness.

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By: Fabio L Leite https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20428 Thu, 02 Jun 2011 14:32:49 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20428 In reply to Isaac.

That’s very true and an excellente comparison. People shun the compulsion to visible sins in others and many times indulge in their own not-so-visible sins. Also, it seems that there are some sins that are acceptable, while others are not. Gossip, crankiness, acedia, coldness of faith, pride, vanity, gluttony, sometimes even anger,sexual misbehaviour that is kept under the carpet, love of wealth and comfort all seem to be sins we can “live with”, while the more explicit sins, or those that weaken the victim socially instead of making them social predators, these are to be severely excluded. Pusilanimous subservience to the strong, arrogant spite to the weak. Are we not falling into the parable of the two debtors?

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By: Isaac https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20415 Thu, 02 Jun 2011 02:11:39 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20415 I don’t really disagree with you Fabio. My issue is with those traditions that heavily push heterosexual marriage as the only normative condition for all but the very old and very young. A gay person should be able to approach the Orthodox faith without feeling like he will have to pretend to be not gay because celibacy is a legitimate path to take and not considered abnormal. The fundagelicals don’t really present this as a viable option and tend to ignore the whole “eunuchs for the kingdom” ethic practiced by St. Paul. And of course there are plenty of gay clergy already who have no business trying to make a relationship with a woman work because they aren’t healed completely of a attraction to the same sex. It is probably somewhat akin to being told that the Church has no room for alcoholics. Now an alcoholic is certainly called to be sober, but if he can’t be in the Church as an alcoholic then he can’t be in the Church.

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By: Fabio L Leite https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20408 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 20:16:20 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20408 In reply to Isaac.

I think it’s up to the person to decide if they will take a therapy and engage in one of the programs that try to heal the homossexual behaviour or if they will go for a life of celibacy. I don’t see anything particular fundamentalist about this.

In my opinion, there are several conditions, of which homosexuality is but one, that are like alcoholism or cleptomania: a sinful action, for whatever reason, genetic, biological, social, psychological or spiritual, has collapsed into a compulsion. In fact, I understand the Fathers of the Church do note this level of seriousness in the development of sin.

Like a missing arm, these conditions can arise for several reasons, natural and accidental, while the healthy state comes only under very strict limits: you can get a disease for many causes, while the healthy state needs healthy genetics, nutrition, environment, etc etc.

Therefore, in some cases it may be true that the person could get healed with willpower and support (like some alcoholics can live a healthy life under certain restrictions). But it may also be true that in some cases the issue may be more serious and cannot be reverted at all. Of course that God can heal everything, but still there are millions of people with a number of conditions that are not healed. It’s not up to us to put God against the wall on that. What we can and should do is treat well and with understanding all those how are not healed of their bodily, mental or spiritual conditions, which does not mean giving support to them in indulging in their condition just because it is not being healed.

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By: Isaac https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20391 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 04:15:08 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20391 While I certainly don’t subscribe to Queer Theory, there is an element of flexibility or plasticity inherent to this framework that at least accounts more for how real people behave vs. the myth of a sharp line of demarcation of straight and gay which is considered nearly immutable, and which has certainly seeped into the popular consciousness through the propaganda of Hollywood (what else would you call it?). This explains why many males will engage in homosexual acts while incarcerated (call it a social pressure if you like) but will “return” to heterosexuality (actually, most of them would insist they never left it despite their acts) upon their release. The biblical emphasis on acts over orientations seems vindicated here. Even so, I don’t think it would be wise for any Orthodox clergy member to try to push a gay person to identify as straight. A life of celibacy seems preferential to the forced attempts of many fundagelicals to utilize therapies to lead gay people into straight relationships.

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By: George Patsourakos https://www.aoiusa.org/medved-does-it-matter-if-only-1-4-of-people-are-gay/#comment-20386 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 01:47:07 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10093#comment-20386 It is interesting to learn that a new study shows that only 1.4 percent of Americans identify themselves as being gay. Previously, most Americans believed that about 10 percent of the population was gay.

Perhaps there appear to be more gays in the U.S. because gays tend to be very vocal in often expressing their rights to be gay.

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