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Comments on: Maggie Gallagher: The Chilling of Our First Amendment Rights https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/ A Research and Educational Organization that engages the cultural issues of the day within the Orthodox Christian Tradition Thu, 28 Jul 2011 06:48:15 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.3.3 By: Carson Chittom https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20869 Thu, 28 Jul 2011 06:48:15 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20869 I think it’s important to be clear on terminology and call a spade a spade. While I do “believe marriage is the union of husband and wife,” the fact that someone declined to speak when offered the opportunity is not a First Amendment issue. Your premise that “The First Amendment is more than a legal guarantee. It is a culture — a key American value — which holds that in a decent and free society, law-abiding citizens should not face reprisals for speaking up with civility for the moral good as they see it.” is simply not true. It’s true that we have the First Amendment because Americans historically (and, for the most part, modernly—is that a word? Firefox doesn’t underline it, so I guess so) do in fact hold such a value and so amended the Constitution to prohibit the Congress from making laws against it.[1] But the value and the legal guarantees of the First Amendment are not the same thing.[2]

In point of fact, while the threats and intimidation she faced were despicable (and possibly criminal, under other statues) acts, the woman who refused to speak is the exact opposite of a First Amendment curb: far from Congress “abridging the freedom of speech,” they gave her the opportunity to speak.

Regarding your other examples, there’s certainly a discussion to be had about whether employers should be barred from taking action against employees for statements made off the job (or even statements made on the job, but which do not pertain to their duties)—written properly, I think I’d support such a measure. But the fact is, in a lot of places, you can be fired “for good cause, or bad cause, or no cause at all.” I’d be interested to see if there’s any case law on whether a firing for statements made in defense of marriage would constitute discrimination on the basis of religion under Title VII.

[1] Of course, even that has never been seen as a legal absolute, as witness slander and libel laws.
[2] Also, I quibble with your apparent assertion that only “law-abiding” citizens should not face reprisals for their speech.

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By: Joe Hegyi III https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20818 Sun, 24 Jul 2011 22:53:34 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20818 I certainly am appalled that, especially in so short a time, it has become nearly impossible to state that marriage is between a man and a woman without facing abuse and ridicule. However, these activists have learned from those who went before them. Before white Christians were forced on the run and we had the power we did exactly the same thing. For how many decades did white “Christians” keep control of things by threatening, or even carrying out, violence in the name of God? I don’t want to see anyone have that position again but I’m sure from their perspective it’s only giving as well as we gave.

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By: Tomas https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20811 Fri, 22 Jul 2011 22:29:03 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20811 In reply to Dn Brian Patrick Mitchell.

Dn Mitchell: As a rule of thumb, I think freedom of speech is an almost absolute right, at least in sense that we should not fear civil penalties for expressing our opinions and beliefs. I also generally think that individuals should be free to express their beliefs publicly without reprisal from their place of employment if it’s off the clock. Of course, companies should also be free to fire someone whose publicly expressed views are a potential embarrassment and cost to the company, whether the person is a member of the KKK or NAMBLA. I wouldn’t want a representative from either camp holding a high level position in my company, quite frankly. If they were, they’ve become a liability, no matter how good their “performance” was.

If you’re referring to the firing of Dr. Frank Turek at Cisco, then by all accounts, no, he should not have been fired as his beliefs were not expressed at work, nor does it appear that those beliefs led towards discriminatory employment practices on his part. I’ve written in support of people in both the private sector and academia who have been fired due to political correctness, and I’m sure I’m not the first one to do so.

See, when I say I believe in freedom, I mean it. I don’t mean “freedom for everyone and everything I personally agree with”. Unfortunately, given the fierce opposition to ENDA laws and any law that protects a person from being evicted or fired for sexual orientation, I don’t think this is really about “freedom” of anything.

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By: Micahel Bauman https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20810 Fri, 22 Jul 2011 17:59:34 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20810 In reply to Dn Brian Patrick Mitchell.

Of course he does, everything is equal, except some ideas are more equal than others.

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By: Dn Brian Patrick Mitchell https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20809 Fri, 22 Jul 2011 17:07:40 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20809 In reply to Tomas.

So, Tomas, you equate one idiot with a placard with a media corporation actually firing someone for expressing his religious beliefs publicly?

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By: Eliot Ryan https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20807 Fri, 22 Jul 2011 12:50:23 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20807 In reply to George Patsourakos.

The US is following Europe’s footsteps
St. Justin Popovic: Whither does humanistic culture lead?
Europe made use of Christ “merely as a bridge from uncultured barbarism to cultured barbarism; that is, from a guileless barbarism into a sly barbarism.” (Bp. Nikolai [Velimirovich])

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By: George Patsourakos https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20805 Fri, 22 Jul 2011 04:14:26 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20805 It is a sad day for America’s freedom of speech, when a person is being harassed with death threats, if he speaks before Congress to support DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act). To attempt to deny a person the right to express his opinion that marriage is a union between one man and one woman — by frightening that person with a death threat — completely contradicts the U.S. Constitution, as well as the principles of freedom that America’s founding fathers worked so diligently to attain. Indeed, a person making such a threat needs to be brought to justice by the FBI or other federal law enforcement agency.

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By: Tomas https://www.aoiusa.org/maggie-gallagher-the-chilling-of-our-first-amendment-rights/#comment-20801 Thu, 21 Jul 2011 20:36:58 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=10447#comment-20801 There’s extremists on every side of every issue. Are we expected to vote against gay marriage because there are some radical gay activists out there? If so, are we then expected to vote FOR abortion because a few whack jobs have decided to bomb abortion clinics?

Of course, Maggie neglected to mention the placard one of her supporters brought to a NOM rally which featured “The Solution to Gay Marriage” followed by a picture of a hangman’s noose: http://thepoliticalcarnival.net/2010/07/27/photoh-the-so-called-solution-to-gay-marriage/

Surely, you have better arguments than this drivel. The SCOTUS recently sided with Westboro Baptist, perhaps the most disgusting and vitriolic anti-gay group in America. Free speech isn’t going anywhere in this nation…

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