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Comments on: Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew: Unity in God’s Time https://www.aoiusa.org/ecumenical-patriarch-bartholomew-unity-in-gods-time/ A Research and Educational Organization that engages the cultural issues of the day within the Orthodox Christian Tradition Thu, 08 Oct 2009 18:02:15 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.3.3 By: Chrys https://www.aoiusa.org/ecumenical-patriarch-bartholomew-unity-in-gods-time/#comment-6611 Thu, 08 Oct 2009 18:02:15 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=3797#comment-6611 In reply to Fr. Johannes Jacobse.

I’m not sure who looks worse in all this: the EP who thought this might somehow clarify his point (when in fact it distracts, at best) or the audience for whom such a reference was assumed to be appropriate.

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By: Fr. Johannes Jacobse https://www.aoiusa.org/ecumenical-patriarch-bartholomew-unity-in-gods-time/#comment-6608 Thu, 08 Oct 2009 16:30:12 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=3797#comment-6608 In reply to Andrew.

Right you are Andrew. The term “apophaticism” functions these days to mean “you can’t really know the Orthodox faith so I am going to tell you what it is”, and then people take license to say whatever is on their mind. Ideas end up floating in space, a kind of pick and choose Christianity but Orthodox style.

(I am not implying that His All Holiness is doing this of course, merely confirming that I see the same misuse of the term in many places as well.)

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By: Fr. Johannes Jacobse https://www.aoiusa.org/ecumenical-patriarch-bartholomew-unity-in-gods-time/#comment-6607 Thu, 08 Oct 2009 14:56:25 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=3797#comment-6607 Is anyone troubled (like I am) with the reference to the “ancient god Janus?” Yes, there is some value in the ancient mythology (myth is narrative after all, and narrative organizes knowledge and makes it coherent and comprehensible), but in this context the reference to Janus functions authoritatively; it clarifies (and thus justifies?) the thesis that the unity of the Churches is a function of (chronos and) kairos.

Why is the meaning of a biblical reference (Heavenly City) clarified by a reference to a mythological explication of time and purpose? Further, given that the speech is primarily a moral exhortation, doesn’t it implicitly posit two centers of authority — scripture and Greek (pre-Cappadocian Hellenism) mythology?

Granted, the “ancient god Janus” is mentioned only in passing. But why mention it at all?

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By: Andrew https://www.aoiusa.org/ecumenical-patriarch-bartholomew-unity-in-gods-time/#comment-6605 Thu, 08 Oct 2009 14:39:17 +0000 https://www.aoiusa.org/?p=3797#comment-6605 How can you have unity with people who do not believe the events in the Bible are real? The EP should evangelize this group not compromise with this group.

Also, every time I hear apophaticism these days, I cringe. All kind of shenaigans are justified by a misunderstanding of apophaticism. In some circles apophaticism is the new relativism.

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