Sigh….give me a break. Please, for the love of all things….stop reading what the (US Govt run) media tells you about Putin. They have an agenda to make him the boogeyman. The US led coup in Kiev is what started all of that trouble. “Invasions and murders”……LOL. The utterly naive crack me up.

This is what wedding vows are for. Maybe we need them.

Just as a hypothetical, the bishop could require that a couple sign a pre-nuptial agreement as a condition for being married in the Church. In the agreement both parties promise not to divorce. Should there be a divorce it must be for reasons allowed by the canons (apostasy, monastic profession, adultery or abandonment) and with the understanding, also in writing, that only the injured party may petition the bishop for a second, marriage (and then using the penitential service not the crowing service).

Pre-marital counseling has generally proven effective within the church, not only in weeding out those who were not ready but preparing dedicated couples for the potential conflicts and issues. How should this play out in granting civil marriage licenses, if it all? (I’m speaking hypothetically since I doubt civil marriage will face increased restrictions anytime soon.)

When you are willing to defend ALL life, then, and only then, will your moral campaign resonate with God and with men.

Hopefully, Fr. Patrick plans to issue some other from of documentation for the marriages he does perform,. Otherwise, he might inadvertently participate in a bigamy. Perhaps as a convert, Fr Patrick is unaware that in the 20th century bigamy by immigrant men who left a family behind in the ‘Old Country’ was not an insignificant occurrence.

What is more troubling is the absolute obsession with sins, such as gay “marriage” which, by definition, occur outside the church; while tragic sins that occur within the church are ignored or swept under the rug.

While our resident moralists decry the violence against the unborn, our leaders have been silently complicit in acts of genocide, acts committed by “Orthodox” militias or the armed forces of “Orthodox” countries. This week marked the 20 the anniversary of the Srebrenica massacres. While our Orthodox bishops universally decried the bombing of Serbia, did anyone speak out on behalf the the 8,000 (and still counting) unarmed Muslim men and boys who were rounded up and executed in cold blood?

Fro over 25 years the Orthodox Christians of Georgia have endured massacres and ethnic cleansing at he hands of the Russian military and its mercenary Muslim militias. During the 2008 invasion of Georgia, the Russian bishops Panteleimon of Kabardia-Adyghe and Feofan of Saratov crossed over into the territory of the Georgian Orthodox Patriarchate in order to publicly “bless” the armaments used to kill innocent civilians and used to desecrate the Ghvrtaeba Cathdral and the Shrine of the Protomartyr Razhden. These infernal blessing were televised in both Russia and later in Georgia.

Where is the cry of the Orthodox conscience when innocent blood is shed; when innocent Orthodox Christians are tortured and slaughtered without mercy?

No where. In the words of the Akathist hymn, our moralists and bishop resolutely remain “as dumb as fish”.

It is easy to criticize outsiders; but no one has the courage to confront the evil within.

The current Russian invasion of Ukraine, has cost over 6,000 civilian lives. Another 5,000 Russian soldiers have died although the Russian government denies their very existence We know of this figure, because the organization of “Mothers of Russian Soldiers” has used its Facebook network to compile the statistics. There are no over 1 million refugees from thje invasion and occupation of the Donbas.

Below are eyewitness testimnies of the atrocities committed against innocent civilians during the 3 Russian invasions of Orthodox Georgia.

Your obsession with sins outside the church, while you ignore the sins committed in the church is a travesty and a sign of moral degeneracy.

For more on on the sufferings of innocents read on:

From the Martyrdom of St Andrea Kurashvili and St Giorgi Adua, the restorers and guardians of the Shrine of the Repose of St John Chrysostom in Komana:

At 3 o’clock at night, the battle had spread to the very temple. “Any moment we can expect death. Let us prepare for confession and Holy Communion.” father Andrew told them, and for the last time he brought out the Holy cup from the Alter and gave them Communion. “Father Andrew was very calm when he announced to us to prepare for Communion. After the Communion he asked us not to talk amongst ourselves and to try to turn our thoughts deep within so that in this hell we can hear the quiet, but ever powerful and majestic voice of the eternity. These moments were unforgettable… The light soul of father Andrew revealed itself to us with unknown and mysterious force, he felt towards us the most gentle and all reaching love of Christ, seeing God’s light according to the words: And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.” (John 1,5) A feeling overcame us that father Andrew is breaking into the other dimension of life where harmony and beauty rules and that no hellish forces, all joined together, will be able to do anything to him, because the source of this indescribable beauty and grace is God Himself, eternal and all reaching”- witnesses the novice Maria.

At 5 o’clock in the morning outside they started yelling for them to open the door. With the blessing of father Andrew, Yuri opened the door. They grabbed him and with beating they dragged him outside. They were hitting him with the butts of their rifles and they dragged him away such that none saw him again. Latter it became known that he was dignified with a martyr’s death.

Later they also dragged out father Andrew and as the lamb is mute before its shearers, in such a way he too did not open his mouth. Father Andrew sought to accept that cup and he drank it. He kneeled on his knees and he fervently prayed. The drunken militants asked Father Andrew asked: “whose land is this, Abkhaz or Georgian?” Father Andrew calmly replied: “The land belongs to God”. His enemy shot him in the back of his head, but he even in death, he did not surrender himself and submit to them. Instead of, according to logic, falling down on his face, he fell on his back. For twenty minutes from the wound poured out streams of blood.

In the mean time the group that was in the temple did not know what was happening outside. After they took out father Andrew the wild and drugged up Abhaskan soldiers came into the temple, started to shout, swear and to desecrate it, and they even tipped over the grave of St. John Chrysostom, and after 3 hours some young man ran in and yelled out: “They killed your elder!”. They with all their strength went to the place of the crime and found the martyred body of their young by age, but elder by wisdom, spiritual father and Hieromonk Andrew. On his face, instead of a grimace there was a sweet smile.

At the same time sub-deacon Giorgi Adua, was dragged away and nailed to a tree, in mockery of Christ’s crucifixion. The drunken soldiers used him for target practice, shooting at his arms and legs until he died from blood loss.

“The Abkhazian separatists searched for everything they considered worthy, terrorized and killed Georgian peaceful inhabitants.”

“…When they [Abkhaz] entered Gagra, I saw Shamyl Basaev’s battalion. I have never seen such a horror. They were raping and killing everyone who was captured and dragged from their homes. The Abkhaz commander Arshba raped a 14 year old girl and later gave an order to execute her. For the whole day I only could hear the screams and cries of the people who were brutally tortured. On the next day, I witnessed the mass execution of people on the stadium. They installed machine guns and mortars on the top and placed people right on the field. It took a couple of hours to kill everybody…”

The Georgian government repeatedly appealed to the UN, OSCE, and other international organizations to intervene, while at the same time refusing offers of Russian military assistance. Several UN Security Council resolutions and decisions failed to lead to a de-escalation of the conflict.

“…When the Abkhaz entered my house, they took me and my seven year old son outside. After forcing us to kneel, they took my son and shot him right in front of me. After they grabbed me by hair and took me to the nearby well. An Abkhaz soldier forced me to look down that well; there I saw three younger men and couple of elderly women who were standing soaked in water. They were screaming and crying while the Abkhaz were dumping dead corpses on them. Afterwards, they threw a grenade there and placed more people inside. I was forced again to kneel in front of the dead corpses. One of the soldiers took his knife and took the eye out from one of the dead near me. Then he started to rub my lips and face with that decapitated eye. I could not take it any longer and fainted. They left me there in a pile of corpses…”

” After the city was seized, the streets were covered with bodies. Separatists destroyed the Baramidze, Chkhetia, Baramia, Gvazava, Dzidziguri, Absandze, Shonia, and Kutsia families, as well as many others…”

The war ended in late September 1993 with Abkhazeti’s virtual secession from Georgia through a radical ethnic cleansing of its multi-ethnic population and the destruction of its cities, including Sokhumi. Just at the beginning of the war adherents of Vladislav Ardzinba started killing, tormenting, raping, and robbing the inhabitants of Georgian nationality. At first Georgians of the following towns and villages experienced the sadism of the separatists: Gagra and Gudauta, Akhaladze, Bzipi, Ipnari, Otkhara, Akhali Sopeli, Eshera, Kochara, Ketevani, Labra, Kvitouli, Kindgi, etc. Ugrekhelidze, an inhabitant of the village Eshera, was forced to dig a hole of his own height, then he was pulled out his teeth and nails, and buried alive. They left his hand above the ground (the symbol of the Abkhazian banner.) Another Georgian was captured, cut his veins. Then the Abkhazian separatists poured his blood into glasses and drank it. After this they let him go to Sokhumi to tell everybody how Abkhazians drank Georgian blood.

The Abkhazian butchers captured sisters – Eka Jvania (17 years old) and Marina Jvania (14 years old), Leila Samushia and others in village Pshadi. They undressed them in front of their parents and neighbors, and raped them. After this the Abkhazian butchers executed all of them by shooting.

It’s just a drop in the ocean of separatists violence. 50,000 innocent people were killed in Abkhazian War in 1992-1993.

“…They captured a young girl. She was hiding in the bushes near the house where they killed her parents. She was raped several times. One of the soldiers killed her and mutilated her. She was cut in half. Near her body they left a message: as this corpse will never be as one piece, Abkhazia and Georgia will never be united either…”

digitalcaucasus.blogspot.com/search/label/abkhazia

The time to stop cooperating with the state is when the state tells you to do something wrong. That hasn’t happened yet, so what do we accomplish by stopping cooperation now? Maybe I also have missed something, but I’ve asked this question a few times now on different sites, and I still haven’t heard an answer.

I’ve done the same thing. Once I cancelled a wedding after it was scheduled to begin. I know of other priests who refused to marry couples as well.

For what it’s worth, I have refused to marry couples I thought were unlikely to remain married. I have done so twice and once told another priest my concern for a couple’s fitness for marriage. He listened, did the wedding, they divorced within the year. So did the two couples who married civilly after I said no.

Why not try making your point in declarative sentences? You are still not clear.

You have seriously misconstrued my point. I am sorry to say that I would not contend the Orthodox are capable of “baiting” anyone at this point, but are only capable of being baited. Again, attempting to beat the civil authorities at their own game by refusing to sign these silly forms is ludicrous. And ultimately to what end? To openly demonstrate by “action” the forthrightness of our convictions? “Pardon me, you are who again, from what church?” Please. Orthodox priest of every jurisdiction have been performing marriages with couples they knew in their hearts would be divorced within several years, rather than take a moral stand and refusing to participate. Now you would have us believe that that because of this recent SCOTUS decision we are “born-again hardcore” on the theology of marriage? Let’s do a little epidemiological research here, shall we, “Christian Marriage in the time of Obergefell v. Hodges”: We’ll look at all marriages conducted in the Antiochian jurisdiction and track them for 5 years to see the number of ensuing divorces. Likewise, we’ll ask our priests – if, in fact, we can enlist any participants – their honest opinion prior to the marriage of their perceived outcome. How is it that this “blaspheme” against the icon of what St. Paul refers to as the example, par excellence, of the unity of Christ and His Spotless Bride, the Church seems to distress no one?

As to your second point, you seem to have a way of limiting my capacity to appreciate that our God acts as He wishes and according to His wisdom, not according to the wisdom of men. While I may never live live to actually see the Justice of our God on this earth, I accept His promise with my whole heart.

If we wish to cut our relationship with the State then we should simply refuse to marry sacramental those who have married civilly. Unlike Anglican clergy in the UK (or Orthodox clergy in Grece), clergy in America are not agents of the State because in there is no established Church in the US. In signing a marriage license the priest, together with the best man and maid of honor, is a witness to a CIVIL contract entered into by the bride and groom. While the State now (wrongly) accepts such contracts between same sex couples this doesn’t invalidate the civil contract made by a man and a woman.

I would argue that as long as the Church allows baptized Orthodox Christians to enter civil marriages the relationship between Church and State is not cut. No the only way to cut the relationship between Church and State on this issue is for the Church to refuse to marry sacramentally those who have married civilly. I’m not proposing this but it seems to me the only way to cut the relationship between Church and State at least as it pertains to marriage. Maybe I’ve missed something and if I have I’m open to correction.

In Christ,

FrG

Do you understand what Fr. Reardon is proposing? This is not “baiting” and there will no need to “side-step” the State since by refusing to sign the civil licence the relationship has already been cut. This shouldn’t make any difference to the State at all, thus no “baiting.”

As for God and the oppression of the righteous, true of course but maybe not in the way that you think. In the Soviet Union many of the righteous died in the Gulags.

Refusing to do the will of the state does not necessarily mean one is doing the will of God.